Saturday, 27 August 2022

How times have changed.

 I had a smile to myself on reading Caitlin Moran in today's Times.   She is writing about teenage years. I never had a daughter and of course it is a long time since I was a teenager - she writes about having 'sex with a stranger at a festival 30 years ago' (when she was 17).   I looked back to when I was 17 were there festivals then?   And if there were then I most certainly would not have been permitted to go.  Those were the days when I had to see the end of the film before the beginning in order to catch the 10.15pm bus home and my father would be waiting at the gate to see me get off the bus.

There was no pill in those days and like most of my friends and most of the girls in the village I suspect, I went to the altar a virgin.   Goodness me, I  don't think many girls can say that these days.   Does that make things better or worse?   Does it matter?  In this small town where I live now it seems that many young people change partners quite a few times and have very complicated family lives.   As Caitlin says - you have to let your young people turn from being a caterpillar into a butterfly at their own pace,  she says there's time to get excited about things like "the Lakeland Catalogue" once their "vagina has atrophied and they need to wear special shoes".   Goodness me - my dear mother will be turning in her grave.

How do you feel about the whole thing?

22 comments:

Tasker Dunham said...

I think there are many things better about having fewer restrictions and today's less repressed attitudes, but young people seem to have more serious mental health issues. Or maybe we always had them - for different reasons - but didn't talk about them.
One of my mother's cousins said that she received a toy pram with a life-sized baby doll for her 12th birthday, and walked it proudly along the high street.

Derek Faulkner said...

From odd things that you have said over the past few years I rather gather that you had a rather sheltered teenage time with few if any risque events, what would later be considered as extremely square. Having grown up through such restrictive times I guess you ended up being extremely jealous of the freedoms that teenagers later experienced in the 1960's, or continued to frown and tut-tutt for ever more - I'd guess that you continued with the latter.I agree with the Times correspondents comments.

jan b said...

Weaver may well have led a sheltered teenage life, pretty normal for the times in rural communities I imagine. However I find her attitude intelligent,open,thoughtful, respectful and kind. Rather more than can be said for Derek Faulkner. Jan Bx

Heather said...

I suspect I feel rather as you do about it. I haven't read the article and I suppose I had a sheltered upbringing, but each to his or her own, and I don't feel I missed out on anything worth having.

Anonymous said...

Yes, I am shocked by “Derek’s knowing” of Weaver. Just plain rude.

Brenda said...

I was sheltered also…

Ursula said...

Derek Faulkner,in future you may use "extremely" more judiciously when leaving a comment. Let's leave aside that, as Anon and Jan B say, you are "plain rude" and out of order. I don't know how old you are considering that you are so "knowledgeable" about the "sixties".

"Jealous"? What would Weaver be jealous about? Being coerced into "free" love because suddenly there were no consequences (ah, the "blessings" of the pill). You know what? Not that I did [know]since I was only a child in the sixties. Those very "free" women opening their legs to any and all were derided, possibly by the likes of you, as "easy".Spat on.

Weaver, the above may sound blunt. I have read many of FD's comments here and on other blogs.I shan't speculate on his motives. That's between him and his conscience. However, please do not let yourself be discouraged to say what you think, ponder on.To me, it's an education.

As ever, and full of admiration for your continuing spirit and interest in life,
U

Anonymous said...

Rarely do I comment on a negative comment but Derek needs to pull his head in.-Pam, Aust.

Derek Faulkner said...

I made a few guesses at the form Pat's sheltered life might of took, it was certainly not "knowing" as the person with no name suggested. That aside having honest opinions will often be seen as rudeness by some people, so be it.

Anonymous said...

Yikes. I'm startled by what seems like an unduly harsh reading of our hostess' measured and compassionate reaction to what sounds like a rather vulgar and self satisfied newspaper column. Sometimes these comments tell us a lot more about the commenter than about the subject of the comment.

c

the veg artist said...

Whilst I don't think many of my generation would have been virgins when they married, the idea of sex with a total stanger, as in a 'hook-up' arranged by phone, or even 'friends with benefits' makes me feel quite sad for the girls involved. Aside from the danger element, it can't be good for the psyche.

Bonnie said...

Pat, both of my parents would be horrified about what is in today's papers or on TV.

I resent that the paper chooses to print the scorn that the young woman heaps upon anyone older than she is, because, as we all know, at that age we all knew better than our elders. And I was as guilty as anyone, but at least it wasn't printed in the paper.

When I was in high school, there were a number of girls who "went to help out their aunt" for a year. Only years later do I appreciate how much our parents were trying to protect us from having to face that in our teens.

Bonnie in Minneapolis

Susan said...

I agree, "comments" are a direct reflection of the individual making the statement. I will leave it at that. Pat, I appreciate your views and sharing of your experiences on your blog. In high school, I had friends that used the birth control pill at age 15, 16 and 17. A few got pregnant and then had abortions. Some (not all) experienced great sadness. One girl after marrying could no longer have children.

jinxxxygirl said...

We all make choices.. Derek made his choice to say what he did in his comment.. One wonders what his motive is or why it was necessary to voice that.. was he just after the shock value... I for one do not remember Derek ever being that rude before to Pat.. Pat i admire you for myriad of subjects you are willing to discuss on your blog.. I was not a virgin when i married at 20.. I'am in my mid 50's now.. I was born in 67' so i cannot tell you much about the 60's .. I think values, restrictions and morals have their place in society.. You know how it is said that children function better when there are rules and guidelines for them to follow.. I think that should follow us to some degree into adulthood.. Perhaps thats the issue with all the mental problems our young people see to have these days. ..in a world where 'anything goes' maybe thats the problem... Keep the interesting subjects coming Pat.. You make me stop and think and that can only be a good thing.. Hugs! debs

Debby said...

I believe that things were just not so openly discussed and that sex happened back when you were younger as well...it just wasn't so openly spoken of.

PS I knew a woman who would say the rudest things, and follow it up with: 'i am a very honest person' as if it this made her rudeness a virtue. She knew she was being rude. She was simply trying to excuse that behavior.

RunNRose said...

Weave, I'm about ten years younger than you. I was a virgin when I married my Old Man. He was almost as old as you. I lost him in April after 58 years. He was my everything. And, to us, sex was something sacred. That "two become one" belief made real.
Never did I feel deprived by my "lack of experience"; I certainly never envied people that I considered less fortunate than me. Those who "sleep around" can't possibly have experienced the joy that we shared. I am not religious, but I think it sad that nowadays sex seems to be something purely physical. Not much different from shaking hands. I am so glad you had two great marriages, and that you share so much of your life, memories, thoughts, etc. with us.
I'm so sorry that someone found it necessary to attack you. Notice how so many rush to your defence. You are loved here.

thelma said...

Well where to start Pat ;) pigeons and cats come to mind. Especially when I am listening to the 'Female Eunuch' at the moment. The mythology of the 60s, then The Pill arriving on the scene. The Pill brought about female emancipation freed from the restrictions of marriage and babies, women could educate themselves and work. We have a lot to thank for that. The men likewise! I think attitudes to sex shows up into what decade you were brought up in, we had back street abortions and illegitimate babies taken away for adoption to think about from the 1950s. Perception is master here.
I miss reading Caitlin, especially about her dog, it was a Cockerpoo or something.

Derek Faulkner said...

At last, someone who accepts both Pat's and my comments for what they were, that attitudes to sex were different according to what decade you were brought up in, thank you thelma. In my comments I summarised by simply suggesting that Pat stuck with the moral outlook from her decade whereas I, as a teenager in the 1960's, had a far more liberal one. It was not intended to be rude and was most definitely not, as absurdly suggested, an attack on her.

Rachel Phillips said...

Don't worry Derek, the same happened to me here. The overseas readers do not understand British conversation between friends. I read your comment last night and couldn't see anything wrong with it and I am sure Pat won't either. I understood what you were saying. Put it down to cultural differences in dialogue between friends in diverse lands.

Librarian said...

I was born in 1968 and had a liberal childhood and teenage years. But because I was a very ugly girl, no boys were attracted to me, so that sex was not something ‚available‘ to me until I was 20 - I would have liked to have a boyfriend long before that, but there simply was nobody interested in me.
Even later, sex with a total stranger would not really interest me, although I did have a few adventures which I enjoyed, during a time when I was not in a relationship. I never wanted children, so taking the pill eas a no-brainer.
During my teens, I felt sorry for those girls who changed boyfriends all the time, and even more so when they ended up pregnant and could not be out partying and clubbing with the rest of us.

The Weaver of Grass said...

Oh my goodness how I seem to have put the cat amongst the pigeons again! First of all thank you all for replying so honestly - yes there do seem to be cultural differences and once again wouldn't it be great to be sitting in my sitting room with a drink and chatting about it all.

I shall do a follow up post today so no more to say today except thank-you for contributing.

Tom Stephenson said...

If anyone thinks that everything changed in the 1960s, they should look up 'Victorian Pornography' in images. This is not a recommendation, just an observation which could enlighten you.